There’s one thing about interviewing a superstar; there’s quite another when you discover such acreage of common ground it gets as scary as it is exciting. So I stood back, drew breath and took inspiration from what I knew and where I was. I’ve met and talked with many more famous and infamous, so this was just another guy on another day in St James’ London. But this one does have natural presence.
This was a few days ago now. I was at the preview of Marco Pierre White’s new Channel 5 series, ‘Marco Pierre White’s Kitchen Wars’. We were in his St James’ restaurant, Wheeler’s – a name about as old and established as any London restaurant there be. We might still have Wheeler’s and Sweeting’s, but Prunier, Overton’s and Cunningham’s are ancient history from a London with real style.
The genuinely unique – meaning eclectic and one-off – Sweeting’s (Queen Victoria Street, City – near St Paul’s) is a favourite of Philip Starck – he visits there to eat at his counter of choice when he’s in London - and I have something to do with that even though I’ve never been lucky enough to meet that particular superstar.
Marco swept into his TV preview like a man who’s 10 minutes late for every rendezvous - chef’s jacket under his pinstripe suit – chequer-board canvas Van’s on the feet. The PRs were all around him – you could tell he’d prefer to be left alone. It is his restaurant for goodness sake. We sat theatre style, drank coffee and watched the preview and all was clear - he was in his stage clothes.
It’s Channel 5′s largest, biggest budget series ever with 7 x 60 minute episodes. They made clear they hope to hang onto Marco for a few years. Marco was cool and uncommital at the press conference which followed the screening.
Two lights went on for me. First, I liked the pace and tone of the programme – banter yes, but none of that gratuitous and frankly tiresome bullying that is the measure of most reality TV from names already ‘dissed in my writing. As a minimal TV viewer, I expect everything I watch to be splendid – if disappointed I walk away.
The preview over – time for questions. I’d planned to stay quiet and wait for others so better to measure the mood for Marco. Instead I was first to shoot from the front row - what did Marco mean about couples being the essence of a successful restaurant?
30 years rolled off in 2 minutes – Marco replied without need of a moment’s thought: “Pierre (Koffmann) and Annie at La Tante Claire (now PK and Claire at Koffmann’s Knightsbridge), Albert & Michel (Roux) at Le Gavroche, The Interlude and other great London restaurant combinations”.
He could and should have listed Chris Corbyn and Jeremy King at the top of St James’ in The Wolseley – their +30 year legacy sets the London scene into modern history, not for gastronomy but for pure élan.
Marco lives by the model of the classical French kitchen – a brigade based on a military model. He goes a stage further and here it get’s exciting.” Anyone can have a go in a kitchen”, he says. “It’s tough, hot, frenetic and sometimes unforgiving. Think of it as like the French Foreign Legion, where all are accepted but much is expected in those 7 years before amnesty is granted”. Under-performers can shine in a kitchen, he was saying.
“Students going off on gap years would be better spending their time in a kitchen than hanging out on beaches in Bali or Cairns. At the very least, they’d end up with life skills they could use – and if nothing else, would have learned how to feed their families well when the time came to settle down, ” he added.
Why hasn’t the Government figured such a blindingly simple concept? Thumbs up for Marco in a city where kitchen apprenticeships count for so little, where more kitchens are de-skilling and labour comes cheap.
C5′s ‘Kitchen War’s’ is centred on the couples principle – with Marco striding, strutting and talking his way through big TV sets alongside his expensively customised battle bus from Leeds to Wales, Scotland to London. His TV prop is a large and well used kitchen knife – much like Robin Day’s spotted bow tie, or dear Keith Floyd’s ever-full glass of house red. Marco uses the knife with great effect – a clever and effective construct, whoever dreamt up the idea.
I hung back after the question session as Marco and I had already bonded over gull’s eggs in the conference – you read right, gull’s eggs. He questioned me whether I’d ever eaten one – I broke into a grin and replied that I’d just a week or so back written 1000+ words about them – and plovers’ eggs too.
I adore gull’s eggs full stop. Mid press conference he looked me straight in the eye and said to everyone’s surprise, not least my own: ”You’re my guest to feast on gull’s eggs before the season ends at my country pub in Berkshire – the eggs come from the marshes on the Hampshire coast.”
I asked C5′s PR’s for a 5 minutes 1-to-1 – three questions only, plus I wanted a photo. One after another, journalists sat at his table and asked questions. Marco called for more espresso’s to jump start his weariness and healthily glugged down mineral water. I sat at the bar waiting patiently – a Prosecco was placed before me – my choice, Marco’s call. We call that ‘Chef’s Tea’, of which more another time.
Marco had already declared he preferred reading to watching television – he claimed to not even owning a TV set. Nervous laughter from the C5 team. Instead he loves to read. And what’s his all time favourite food book, I asked – ‘Great Chefs of France’ with words by Quentin Crewe, concept and photography by Anthony Blake.
Funny that – my favourite too – it’s next to me now as I write. This book opened doors for me. AB, as we call him, made introductions to some of the chefs for me. In return, I tried on and off for two years in the late 80s to find a publisher for a Great Chefs Part 2. I talked to elite writers who cared for gastronomy, but no publisher would bite.
Marco became positively alight at talk of Charles Barrier, Jacques Pic, Jean et Pierre Troigros and of course Bocuse and Vergé. Each one old, some passed on, but all men who’ve carved their names into the rock of gastronomy. Paul Bocuse still attends service nightly to ensure every plate leaving the kitchen is to his standard – Marco liked that.
Watching Marco hold court with the press, I was struck by his presence. Quick witted, no sufferer of fools, but impeccably mannered. This is a TV chat show host of the future. His voice betrays his under-priviledged Leeds’ roots.
We talked about his Italian side. He was born here, but his parents came from Verona and emigrated via Genoa. He treasures the station clock from Genoa station he was able to acquire years ago – it’s a strong reminder of where he comes from and what’s possible in life.
He told me how he likes to sometimes dine alone - solo diners are the kitchen’s delight. No co-ordination needed by chef - just send out each course with decent space in between. “So why do I have to wait an age to be served in some provincial restaurants?” he mused. “It’s because the chef goes into a spin when I walk in. I order something simple like the sausages and would like them like everyone else in the room. Instead mine come fanned on a bed of this with a jus of that. This drives me mad.”
Marco’s reputation, like it or not, projected him as a rock n’ roll chef – Tony Bourdain’s the same in New York. Marco made it with sharks before Hirst had got to art school.
Bob Carlos-Clarke’s photographs did nothing to soften this image – some of the shots are framed large downstairs outside the WCs in an area like a Memphis bordello – “I met a far out gypsy queen in Memphis, etc” goes the classic blues. Taking the rock star theme, I asked if he reckoned he’d made his ‘Blonde on Blonde’ yet?
This is sometimes used in the music business as a metaphor from musician to musician to acknowledge a defining piece of work - taken from the iconic Bob Dylan double album ‘Blonde on Blonde’.
“Probably yes,” answered Marco. “I had two Michelin stars at 33 years of age. They meant more to me than anything pretty well since.”
And cooking, I asked? “I haven’t worked in the kitchen now for 13 years. My role is elsewhere.”
This interview comes in two parts. Marco was insistent we meet soon. He scribbled his number in my notebook. We’ll talk Blue Collar Gastronomy and no doubt Anthony Blake’s Great Chefs of France will be on the table too.
Keep your eyes peeled for Marco Pierre White’s Kitchen Wars - 1st episode set for 21h00, June 7, on Channel 5. Tell me what you think. I’ll pass it on.
Photo Credits: Interview shots of Marco and the writer taken by Joe Kerr
Other photography: As always by Joy Davies, including book plates from ‘Great Chefs of France’ (1978) by Anthony Blake & Quentin Crewe
Incidental shots by Gareth Jones
